BusinessMarketingEntrepreneurship

Uncensored CMO

Jon Evans

The Uncensored CMO was created to explore the good, the bad and quite frankly downright ugly truth about marketing theory & practice.

Play

Open in

33 episodes
weekly
Avg 52 min
English

Episodes 33

Newest Oldest Longest

All20 Unplayed20 In progress0 Played0

Counted on this page — what you have heard stays on this device, so it is not something the list can be paged by.

#294
Wednesday · 37 min
How Pinterest grew to 640 million monthly users by doing the opposite of social media
Claudine Cheever, Pinterest’s Chief Marketing Officer, joins Jon Evans to explain the company’s counter-positioning, its growth to 640 million monthly active users, and why trust, design and user experience remain central to the product. Pinterest has built a very different kind of internet platform. Rather than competing for endless attention, it is designed around inspiration, intent and the things people want to do next. They discuss how Pinterest is approaching AI, creators and commerce, why the platform offers brands a distinctive route to consumers, and what Claudine learned from Amazon about leading marketing in a tech business. Sign up to one of our festive events here: https://info.uncensoredcmo.com/festive-events-interest Timestamps 00:00 - Start 00:51 - Claudine’s experience working at Amazon 04:17 - Challenges at Amazon 05:15 - Quick fire marketing hot takes 11:11 - Why Claudine joined Pinterest 11:41 - Pinterest’s intriguing counter-positioning 16:17 - How important is design and user experience to Pinterest 17:34 - Who actually uses Pinterest? 18:56 - What are the trending things right now? 20:57 - The role of the creator on Pinterest 22:14 - How AI has been impacting Pinterest 23:59 - Growing to 640 million Monthly Active Users 25:43 - How Pinterest are driving growth (11 consecutive quarters) 26:31 - How to establish trust in your brand? 27:45 - How Pinterest fuels e-commerce 30:17 - How CMOs should spend the first 90 days at a new brand 31:36 - The secret to being a great tech CMO 32:45 - 3 tips to educate your company on marketing 34:46 - The best advice Claudine has ever been given Thank you to System1 for sponsoring Uncensored CMO. Find out more about Test Your Ad Screen here: https://system1group.com/
#293
October 28 · 50 min
Creativity, Courage and Changing Fortunes - Sonos CMO, Colleen DeCourcy
Colleen DeCourcy is one of the most influential creative leaders in modern marketing. Now Chief Marketing Officer at Sonos, she joins Jon for a candid conversation about the relationship between creativity, commercial performance and leadership through change. They discuss why Colleen joined Sonos, what it takes to turn around a brand, and how to bring creativity back into an organisation when the pressure for short-term results is intense. From Nike’s changing fortunes to the limits of performance marketing, Colleen makes the case for brands that stand for something and leaders prepared to take difficult decisions when it matters. She also reflects on the hardest moment of her career, why great teams need more than talent, and how marketers should approach AI without losing the human judgement that makes creative work valuable. A masterclass in leading creatively when the business needs results. Sign up to one of our festive events here: https://info.uncensoredcmo.com/festive-events-interest Timestamps 00:00 - Trailer 01:42 - The hardest moment of Colleen’s career 09:36 - Why we need more leaders taking a stand for what’s right 10:42 - Colleen’s thoughts on Nike falling out of the S&P 500 13:27 - Why Colleen joined Sonos 17:41 - How Colleen is bringing creativity into Sonos 21:47 - How to approach a brand turnaround 27:27 - How to lead through a time of change 31:17 - Why have we stopped valuing creativity? 34:56 - Whats the best piece of advice Colleen has ever received? 37:26 - Audience questions 40:08 - Colleen’s thoughts on AI 43:48 - How to make your team great Thanks to Émigré for being our official black t-shirt partner. Find your travel wear and accessories at: https://emigre.travel/ Thank you to System1 for sponsoring Uncensored CMO. Find out more about Test Your Ad Screen here: https://system1group.com/
#292
October 21 · 53 min
Duolingo CMO on why playing it safe could be killing your brand
Duolingo has built one of the most distinctive brands in modern marketing, not by playing it safe, but by creating the conditions for its team to move quickly, take risks and occasionally embrace a little chaos. Manu Orssaud, Duolingo’s Chief Marketing Officer, joins Jon Evans to unpack the strategy behind the brand’s biggest moments: from the apparent death of Duo and its rapid-response iPhone content to a Bad Bunny campaign built at the speed of culture. But this is not simply a conversation about being funny on social media. Manu explains the culture of trust required to take creative risks, how to sell bolder work into the business, and how Duolingo measures whether marketing is actually working. They also discuss behavioural science, the limits of brand safety, handling the AI backlash, and why the next phase of Duolingo marketing may involve a little less chaos. A masterclass in building a culturally relevant brand without losing commercial discipline. Timestamps 00:00 - Trailer 01:03 - How do you pronounce Hermes? 02:55 - Duolingo’s iPhone Duo response 04:42 - The culture of trust that enables Duolingo to move fast 05:56 - Has Duolingo ever crossed the line with their social content? 07:55 - The benefits of taking risks 10:31 - The impact of the death of Duo 14:11 - Duolingo’s Bad Bunny campaign - moving at the speed of culture 16:28 - The origin story of the Duo brand mascot 23:05 - How Duolingo uses humour 24:12 - Emigre Sponsor 24:50 - How Duolingo tracks marketing performance 26:15 - Selling risky campaigns into the business 27:06 - The next phase of Duolingo marketing - less chaos 30:37 - How Duolingo is managing this transition 32:56 - Behavioural science insights that have grown Duolingo 34:37 - Duolingo’s AI backlash 38:09 - Going against what your shareholders want 43:46 - What makes Manu a successful CMO 47:47 - The power of constraint 48:46 - Duolingo’s 5 second Super Bowl ad 50:27 - The best advice Manu has ever been given Thanks to Émigré for being our official black t-shirt partner. Find your travel wear and accessories at: https://emigre.travel/ Thank you to System1 for sponsoring Uncensored CMO. Find out more about Test Your Ad Screen here: https://system1group.com/
#291
October 14 · 32 min
LinkedIn Growth Masterclass with LinkedIn CMO, Jessica Jensen
Jessica Jensen, Chief Marketing Officer at LinkedIn, joins Jon Evans for a practical masterclass on what actually works on the platform now. Beginning with a review of Jon’s own profile, they cover the route to becoming a Top Voice, the changing role of B2B creators and how brands can work with them credibly. They also explore the formats that are earning attention, whether collaborator posts genuinely work, and how buyers use LinkedIn to validate the people and companies they choose to work with. Timestamps 00:00 - Intro 01:35 - Jon’s LinkedIn review 11:34 - How do you get a LinkedIn Top Voice 13:23 - The evolution of B2B content creators 14:34 - How brands can work best with creators 16:53 - How LinkedIn are battling AI slop 19:07 - Do collaborator posts on LinkedIn work? 20:02 - What formats work best on LinkedIn in 2026 22:16 - How are B2B buyers making buying decisions on LinkedIn 25:08 - Why LinkedIn is so important for LLMs 25:49 - What jobs is AI creating 29:27 - The best advice Jessica has ever recieved Thank you to System1 for sponsoring Uncensored CMO. Find out more about Test Your Ad Screen here: https://system1group.com/
#290
October 7 · 43 min
How Spotify makes B2B marketing worth listening to - Bridget Evans
Spotify has become one of the world’s most distinctive brands, but what can marketers learn from the way it uses sound, culture and creativity to build emotional connection? Bridget Evans, Spotify’s Global Head of Advertising Business Marketing, joins Jon Evans to explain why audio remains an underused marketing opportunity, and how brands can build an audio strategy people do more than simply hear: they remember it. They discuss the return of the jingle, why taste may become an even more important differentiator in the age of AI, and whether younger audiences really have shorter attention spans, or simply higher standards for what deserves their attention. Bridget also shares how Spotify markets to Gen Z, the enduring impact of Spotify Wrapped, and why the company invests so heavily in Cannes Lions. Timestamps 00:00 - Start 01:22 - Some things people might not know about Spotify 02:42 - Is audio the most underrated channel? 05:15 - Do people trust audio more? 06:58 - Why taste will become the differentiator in the age of AI 07:44 - How audio branding helps emotion 09:11 - How to get your audio strategy right 10:09 - Why we need to bring back more jingles 12:44 - How Spotify markets to Gen Z 15:59 - Do younger generations actually have shorter attention spans? 17:46 - The opportunity for marketers in audio and podcasting 20:00 - How do we make B2B marketing not boring 26:24 - The impact of Spotify Wrapped 30:53 - Why Spotify invest so much in Cannes Lions 34:37 - How Spotify judge the success of their Cannes 36:49 - 3 things to make B2B marketing better 39:42 - Whats the best advice Bridget has ever been given --- This episode is brought to you by System1. Download their creator effectiveness report here: https://system1group.com/the-creator-effectiveness-playbook
#289
September 30 · 59 min
Why marketers are wasting their media budgets - Evan Shapiro
The media landscape has changed faster than most marketing plans have. Evan Shapiro, known as the Media Cartographer for his widely used maps of the media ecosystem, joins Uncensored CMO to explain where attention is really going, which channels marketers are overvaluing, and where the best opportunities may now lie. They assess the relative value of TV, YouTube, podcasts, TikTok, Instagram, LinkedIn and creators, asking a deceptively simple question: are marketers spending in line with how people actually consume media? Evan also explores the shift of power towards consumers, why employee-generated content could become a major force, and where job losses are likely to hit the media industry next. They discuss the rise of founder-led media, the opaque problem of ad fraud, and what Evan has learned from building his own podcast. Timestamps 00:00 - Start 00:42 - Intro to Evan Shapiro 01:43 - Evan’s path into media 03:38 - How to entertain people with keynote speeches 06:37 - The biggest changes in the media universe: the shift to the consumer 10:44 - Where is attention being placed in 2026? 14:20 - The data on attention 17:22 - Overvalued vs Undervalued media 17:57 - TV: Undervalued or Overvalued? 22:29 - YouTube: Undervalued or Overvalued? 25:35 - Why Employee Generated Content is going to be huge 27:53 - Creators: Undervalued or Overvalued? 30:06 - Podcasts: Undervalued or Overvalued? 31:30 - TikTok: Undervalued or Overvalued? 31:57 - Instagram: Undervalued or Overvalued? 32:37 - Facebook: Undervalued or Overvalued? 33:51 - LinkedIn: Undervalued or Overvalued? 35:43 - How will the media landscape change in the next 12 months 39:53 - Where are job losses being felt in media 43:33 - The rise of founders 46:17 - Ad fraud in the media ecosystem 50:30 - Evan’s lessons from running his podcast 56:57 - The best advice Evan has ever been given --- Thank you to our sponsors System1 and HubSpot Download System1's creator effectiveness report here: https://system1group.com/the-creator-effectiveness-playbook Find about more about HubSpot's AEO product here: https://www.hubspot.com/products/aeo
#288
September 23 · 54 min
Marketing leadership masterclass with ex WPP President, Karen Blackett CBE
Karen Blackett is one of the most respected leaders in marketing and media. As the former UK President of WPP and former CEO of GroupM UK, she has led through industry change, crisis and growth at the highest level. In this marketing leadership masterclass, Karen shares the principles that have shaped her career: why great teams need diverse perspectives and healthy tension; why leaders must say what they really think; and how to make better decisions without mistaking consensus for alignment. She reflects on leading GroupM UK through COVID, how she approaches recruitment, and the small meeting habit that helps ensure the most important conversations actually happen. Karen also discusses the evolving client-agency relationship, what the future holds for the creative industry, and the challenge of rebranding Barbados. Timestamps 00:00 - Start 00:51 - Karen’s new leadership podcast 02:03 - The surprising thing about leadership 05:25 - Why we need to change our view of leadership 05:58 - The standout leaders from Karen’s career 11:20 - Karen’s leadership lessons from running WPP 15:55 - The importance of diverse perspectives 17:34 - The importance of saying what you really think 20:28 - How to approach decision making 22:53 - How to approach recruitment 25:34 - Why you need healthy tension in a team 28:46 - Should we banish the voice note? 30:32 - Karen’s big covid turnaround story 34:57 - Why Karen never does “AOB” at the end of meetings 37:25 - The positive side of COVID for Jon 40:06 - How to foster a strong client agency relationship 44:59 - The future of the creative industry 48:42 - Rebranding Barbados 50:51 - What is the freedom of the city 51:48 - The best advice Karen has ever received --- Thank you to our sponsors System1 and HubSpot Download System1's creator effectiveness report here: https://system1group.com/the-creator-effectiveness-playbook Find about more about HubSpot's AEO product here: https://www.hubspot.com/products/aeo
#287
September 16 · 49 min
How to build a disruptive brand and win over the CFO - Vineet Mehra, Chime
What happens when a CMO brings the discipline of P&G, private equity and fintech together? Vineet Mehra, CMO of Chime, joins Jon to explain how the challenger bank has disrupted one of the most established industries in the world - and why modern marketing leaders need to become more fluent in the language of commercial value. Vineet shares what marketers can learn from private equity, how to position investment with a CFO, and the financial metrics he watches most closely. He also unpacks the constant balancing act between long-term brand building and short-term performance: not treating them as opposing forces, but connecting both to sustainable growth. They also discuss where AI is genuinely creating return, how marketers can avoid becoming commoditised, and the skills CMOs will need as AI reshapes the profession. Timestamps 00:00 - Start 01:21 - Vineet’s background at P&G 04:51 - What marketers can learn from working in Private Equity 07:50 - What is Chime Bank? 09:02 - The strategies that Chime used to disrupt the banking industry 13:46 - Advice on how to position marketing to the CFO 17:00 - What financial metrics is Vineet most focused on? 19:40 - How Vineet combines long term and short term marketing 23:59 - Are we in a golden age for marketing? 26:59 - How Vineet is getting the biggest return on his AI investment 31:13 - How to stop AI commoditising marketers 36:09 - What skills will a CMO need in an AI-first future 38:58 - How to see AI as an opportunity not a threat 40:13 - Why Vineet is on the Effie’s board 42:15 - Why Vineet spends time building his personal brand on LinkedIn 46:00 - What’s the bst advice Vineet has ever received? --- Thank you to our sponsors System1 and HubSpot Download System1's creator effectiveness report here: https://system1group.com/the-creator-effectiveness-playbook Find about more about HubSpot's AEO product here: https://www.hubspot.com/products/aeo
#286
September 9 · 47 min
What every Marketer needs to know about the future of search - Google’s Sophie Neary
AI is rapidly changing how people search, shop and discover new brands. So what does that mean for marketers? Sophie Neary has spent the past few years inside Google, giving her a front-row seat to some of the biggest shifts in consumer behaviour and advertising. In this episode, she joins Jon to explore what she's learned, the assumptions marketers still get wrong about Google, and the surprising ways consumers are already using AI. They discuss how brands can show up in AI-powered search, the evolving relationship between advertisers and creators, how to make the most of the crucial golden quarter, and what AI commerce could mean for the future of shopping. Plus, as AI becomes capable of doing more of the work, Sophie and Jon ask a bigger question: which uniquely human skills will become even more valuable to marketers? This episode is an advertisement feature brought to you by Google. Timestamps 00:00 - Start 01:12 - What has Sophie learned in the past few years at Google? 03:07 - CMO lessons from being inside Google 05:11 - What assumption marketers have about Google would Sophie challenge 08:07 - A surprising consumer pattern with AI 11:17 - How brands can show up in AI searches 18:56 - How advertisers can collaborate with creators? 22:09 - How Sophie uses her Google Fitbit Air 24:18 - How to optimise the golden quarter 28:08 - How important will AI commerce be in the future? 30:36 - get them to check this section 34:01 - The most uncensored question for Sophie Neary 37:44 - Where will human skills count in the age of AI? 45:26 - The best advice Sophie has ever been given --- Thank you to our sponsors System1 and HubSpot Download System1's creator effectiveness report here: https://system1group.com/the-creator-effectiveness-playbook Find about more about HubSpot's AEO product here: https://www.hubspot.com/products/aeo
#285
September 2 · 1 hr 2 min
Why uncertainty creates better marketing & what AI will never replace - Dr Margaret Heffernan
Dr Margaret Heffernan is one of the world's leading thinkers on uncertainty, leadership and creativity. A bestselling author, entrepreneur and former CEO, her latest book, Embracing Uncertainty, challenges one of the biggest assumptions in business that the future can, and should, be predicted. In this episode, Margaret explains why forecasting often fails, where great ideas really come from, and why spending more time with uncertainty can actually make us better leaders and marketers. We discuss the dangers of relying too heavily on data, the surprising habits of highly creative people, and why walking might be one of the best things you can do for your thinking. Timestamps 00:00 - Trailer 01:09 - Why pick uncertainty as a topic 05:31 - Why some companies shouldn’t forecast 09:04 - Why smart people are wasting time on forecasting 14:41 - The problem with having too much data 19:07 - Predictability only happens at scale 24:41 - Where do ideas come from? 27:19 - Why the Chief Economist of the Bank of England goes on walks 30:29 - Are we becoming too left brain dominant? 32:32 - The problem with AI 36:10 - Is AI killing our ability to think? 41:17 - How to make good ideas happen 44:11 - The power of surprise 46:15 - The improvisers paradox 49:31 - The correlation between the artists mind and the entrepreneur’s mind 51:57 - What human skills do we need to survive? 58:43 - The best advice Margaret has ever been given --- Thank you to our sponsors System1 and HubSpot Download System1's creator effectiveness report here: https://system1group.com/the-creator-effectiveness-playbook Find about more about HubSpot's AEO product here: https://www.hubspot.com/products/aeo
#284
August 26 · 45 min
How Heineken became creative brand of the year - Ali Payne
Ali Payne, CMO of Heineken, joins us to discuss how one of the world's most iconic beer brands became Creative Brand of the Year at Cannes Lions - and what it takes to keep a 150-year-old brand feeling fresh. From being the "Official Beer of Soccer" as a non-sponsor of the FIFA World Cup to reviving the legendary "Most Interesting Man in the World" campaign, Ali shares how Heineken balances long-term brand building with cultural relevance. We explore what it takes to get an entire organisation behind bold creative ideas, the role of sport in Heineken's marketing strategy, and how brands like Birra Moretti continue to grow through innovation. Timestamps 00:00 - Trailer 00:56 - World Cup fever for the USA and Heineken 02:51 - Jumping on cultural moments 04:25 - Becoming the official beer of soccer (unofficially) 06:50 - How non sponsors got more coverage than sponsors for the World Cup 10:18 - How to manage a 150 year old brand 12:31 - Winning Cannes creative brand of the year 14:46 - Getting the wider business on board with creative work 17:06 - Ali’s favourite Cannes Lions winner 18:38 - Bringing back Dos Equis most interesting man 22:58 - The success of Birra Moretti 24:49 - Heineken’s sports sponsorship strategy 28:32 - How are Heineken bringing new people into the category 29:56 - The ingredients for a successful innovation 33:12 - Heineken’s partnership with Heinz 37:08 - How great CMOs keep creativity alive 40:11 - What makes a great CMO? 41:58 - What’s the best advice you’ve ever recieved? --- Thank you to our sponsors System1 and HubSpot Download System1's creator effectiveness report here: https://system1group.com/the-creator-effectiveness-playbook Find about more about HubSpot's AEO product here: https://www.hubspot.com/products/aeo
#283
August 19 · 55 min
Why AI should drive growth, not just efficiency – Najoh Tita-Reid
Najoh Tita-Reid, former Chief Growth Officer at Mars Petcare, joins us to discuss why she made the unusual decision to step away from one of the biggest roles in marketing to embark on a self-described "learning safari", immersing herself in the world of AI and exploring what it means for the future of business. In this conversation, Najoh shares why she believes too many organisations are using AI purely to drive efficiency, when its greatest opportunity lies in unlocking growth. We explore how AI is changing creativity, leadership and the role of the CMO, why marketers risk becoming tacticians instead of strategic business leaders, and what today's CEOs really expect from marketing. Timestamps 00:00 - Start 00:57 - Why Najoh left Mars 02:18 - Why F1 is the perfect metaphor for AI in 2026 05:18 - Using AI for growth vs efficiency 08:01 - The impact AI is having on creativity 09:17 - Why AI is the colonisation of inefficiency 16:21 - Are we at risk of becoming tacticians and not strategy leaders? 18:52 - Does the CEO understand your role? 22:40 - Can AI actually delivery higher efficiency? 25:00 - What’s the secret to delivering growth 28:24 - What having a different job title gives you permission to do 33:11 - They key leadership skills for a great CMO 34:02 - Why great CMOs are accountable for making change 36:06 - Lessons from Najoh’s biggest failure 40:01 - The difference between culture in the UK and USA 44:09 - What Najoh has learnt on her learning safari 49:47 - The best advice Najoh has ever been given --- Thank you to our sponsors System1 and HubSpot Download System1's creator effectiveness report here: https://system1group.com/the-creator-effectiveness-playbook Find about more about HubSpot's AEO product here: https://www.hubspot.com/products/aeo
#282
August 12 · 54 min
How creativity transformed Australia’s No.1 Telecom’s brand - Brent Smart
Brent Smart is one of the most respected marketers in the world. After spending more than 20 years in advertising, he made the rare move from agency life to become CMO of NRMA Insurance. Brent's most recent role as CMO of Telstra, Australia's largest telecommunications company, he helped transform the brand through bold, distinctive and highly effective marketing. In this episode, Brent shares the principles behind his approach to creativity, from selling big ideas inside large organisations and drawing on academic marketing frameworks to building a culture where great work can thrive. We discuss the campaigns that defined his career, including Telstra's viral "Better on a Better Network" campaign, why humour and surprise remain powerful competitive advantages, and the unique agency model that helped Telstra consistently produce standout work. Timestamps 00:00 - Start 01:03 - Why Brent left Telstra 02:31 - Why Brent moved in house after 20 years agency side 05:41 - How to sell a creative idea into a big organisation 11:01 - The academic frameworks to create great marketing 12:16 - Why you should look at your brands heritage 14:02 - The most successful campaign Brent did for NRMA 17:33 - How Brent won a Grand Effie 21:13 - How Brent transformed Telstra’s brand marketing 26:08 - The Telstra Walk - the viral campaign 32:39 - Using humour to cut through 35:00 - The power of surprise and consistency 37:41 - The unique agency model that helped Telstra create cuthrough work 40:02 - Why craft is so important in 2026 42:44 - How to build a creative culture 47:11 - How to be a great CMO --- Thank you to our sponsors System1 and HubSpot Download System1's creator effectiveness report here: https://system1group.com/the-creator-effectiveness-playbook Find about more about HubSpot's AEO product here: https://www.hubspot.com/products/aeo
#281
August 5 · 48 min
Why your brand can't afford to be boring - Rebecca Darley, Vodafone Australia
Bec Darley, CMO of Vodafone Australia, joins us to discuss what it really takes to grow a challenger brand in one of the world's toughest telecoms markets. From competing against an entrenched duopoly to building distinctive campaigns with Ali Wong, Bec shares how Vodafone has embraced its challenger mindset rather than trying to imitate the market leaders. We explore why marketers need to understand far more than advertising, from unit economics and legal to customer experience and organisational change, and why the best marketing leaders are, ultimately, business leaders. Timestamps 00:00 - Start 00:54 - Who is Bec Darley? 03:31 - Taking on roles beyond marketing to make you a better marketer 05:38 - Why the history of duopolies in Australia makes being a challenger tough 08:53 - How does Vodafone take on the giants as a challenger 12:55 - Leaning into your disadvantage 16:01 - Vodafone’s commercials with Ali Wong 18:37 - The importance of legal for marketing 21:08 - When taking risks backfires - getting banned 24:19 - Focusing on mental availability 26:40 - Are we losing the ability to be creative while hunting efficiency 29:28 - Understanding the unit economics of the business 34:28 - How to manage a portfolio of brands 36:18 - Why you need to be customer first 38:51 - The best marketers move beyond marketing 40:24 - How to make change in a company 43:46 - Embracing discomfort and failing fast 46:23 - Bec’s advice to all young marketers --- Thank you to our sponsors System1 and HubSpot Download System1's creator effectiveness report here: https://system1group.com/the-creator-effectiveness-playbook Find about more about HubSpot's AEO product here: https://www.hubspot.com/products/aeo
#280
July 29 · 1 hr 3 min
20 years of challenger brand lessons with Auto & General CMO, Jonathan Kerr
Jonathan Kerr, CMO of Auto & General, joins us to explore how one of Australia's most successful challenger brands has built sustained growth by combining strong marketing fundamentals with relentless execution. From creating a role for himself at Auto & General to helping Budget Direct become one of the country's fastest-growing insurance brands, Jonathan shares why product should always come before growth, how marketers can take greater ownership of the 4 Ps, and what insurance consistently gets right about creativity. We also discuss the power of distinctive brand characters, audio branding, in-house creative teams and a media strategy designed to maximise long-term effectiveness. Useful links This episode is brought to you by System1. Download their creator effectiveness report here: https://system1group.com/the-creator-effectiveness-playbook Find about more about HubSpot's AEO product here: https://www.hubspot.com/products/aeo Timestamps 00:00:00 - Start 00:01:41 - How Jonathan found out about Auto and General 00:03:31 - How Jonathan created a new role for himself 00:06:58 - How to balance low price with great product 00:10:36 - Market share growth for Budget Direct 00:12:06 - Focusing on product over growth 00:13:59 - How to control more of the P’s 00:16:51 - Why does insurance produce such creative work? 00:20:52 - The power of compounding work in insurance 00:24:21 - Developing brand characters, and when to kill them off 00:30:08 - The power of audio and jingles 00:34:16 - What’s too silly to be said can be sung 00:36:13 - Why they do so much work in house 00:40:34 - Budget Direct’s unique approach to media buying 00:42:43 - How Jonathan uses AI 00:48:04 - The key challenger brand principles Jonathan has followed 00:50:59 - What makes a successful CMO? 00:52:55 - Do we need to re-educate ourselves on marketing theory? 01:00:27 - The best advice you’ve ever recieved
#279
July 22 · 48 min
How YouTube built the creator economy and how brands are still missing out - Pedro Pina, YouTube
Pedro Pina, VP of YouTube for Europe, the Middle East and Africa, joins us to explore how YouTube helped create the creator economy and why so many brands are still failing to take full advantage of it. From the rise of full-time creators to the changing role of YouTube in the media landscape, Pedro explains what makes the platform unique, the metrics that actually matter, and why great content continues to outperform everything else. We also discuss the balance between long-form and Shorts, the "YouTube Confidence Gap" among CMOs, and how brands can build authentic partnerships with creators that drive real business results. If you're wondering where marketing is heading next, this is a masterclass from one of the people shaping it. Get the YouTube Confidence Gap Report from Little Dot Studios: https://info.littledotstudios.com/little-dot-studios-the-youtube-confidence-gap-report This episode is brought to you by System1. Download their creator effectiveness report here: https://system1group.com/the-creator-effectiveness-playbook Timestamps 00:00 - Intro 01:35 - Why YouTube made a creator space in Cannes 03:06 - How Cannes has changed over the past 20 years 06:12 - How many people are paid to be YouTubers 09:39 - The secret of YouTube 11:08 - Who are the biggest creators on YouTube 12:36 - What are the most important metrics on YouTube 14:42 - Why content will always be king on YouTube 15:57 - What makes a succesful YouTuber 19:48 - Is YouTube a broadcaster, streaming platform or social network? 22:36 - How important is short form for creators in 2026 27:24 - The YouTube Confidence Gap 28:56 - What CMOs think about YouTube 29:54 - How to get more confidence in your YouTube strategy 32:53 - The biggest barriers for companies being successful on YouTube 35:00 - How can brands work successfully with creators 39:31 - How can brands be authentic when they work with creators 42:46 - What Pedro wishes CMOs understood better about YouTube 44:14 - The best advice Pedro has ever recieved
#278
July 20 · 49 min
The creative revolution inside the worlds most dull category - Novartis CMO, Gail Horwood
Novartis CMO Gail Horwood joins Janet Balis, Managing Director & Senior Partner at BCG, to explore how one of the world's largest pharmaceutical companies is redefining healthcare marketing. Fresh from winning two Cannes Lions, Gail shares how Novartis is proving that creativity can thrive even in one of the most heavily regulated industries. From partnering with the NFL for a Super Bowl campaign to convincing stakeholders to embrace bolder ideas, we discuss what it takes to create work that stands out while navigating complex regulations. The conversation also explores how AI is reshaping both creativity and business transformation, where marketers should focus their efforts, and why the biggest opportunity for AI isn't just efficiency, but unlocking growth. This episode has been produced in partnership with BCG. Browse their CMO Report here: https://www.bcg.com/publications/2026/making-the-agentic-marketing-transformation-a-reality Timestamps 00:00 - Start 00:49 - Jon’s full circle moment with Norvatis 01:39 - Novartis’ journey to two Cannes Lions 02:54 - Why more people need to walk the work 04:05 - Creating surprising advertising in a heavily regulated category 09:03 - Partnering with the NFL for a Super Bowl campaign 10:24 - How to get your company to embrace risky work 16:01 - How to get stakeholders outside of marketing onboard 19:35 - The reaction to the ads after Super Bowl 21:56 - How AI is being used in the service of creativity 27:04 - How Novartis are using AI for creativity 30:27 - How Novartis are rethinking their marketing with AI 32:46 - Where AI is going to be used outside of marketing 35:03 - AI for efficiency vs growth 37:16 - How to deliver leadership change in the age of AI 40:22 - The boring things AI will solve 42:53 - What makes Gail such a good CMO 44:25 - The worst way to evaluate your career success 45:57 - The best advice Gail has ever received
#277
July 15 · 41 min
Why creativity matters more than ever in the age of AI - Adobe CMO, Lara Balazs
Lara Balazs, CMO of Adobe, joins us to discuss what it takes to lead one of the world's most influential creative brands through a period of enormous change. From Adobe's presence at Cannes to the rapid rise of AI, Lara shares her vision for the company and why she believes technology should be used in service of creativity, rather than simply to drive efficiency. We explore why creativity matters more than ever in the age of AI, the skills Adobe looks for in marketers, and the traits that separate the most successful CMOs. Lara also shares the practical leadership principles she uses to run her team, from creating a company plan on a page and harnessing the power of repetition to prioritising progress over perfection and using the “two-way door” approach to make faster decisions. This episode is brought to you by System1. Download their creator effectiveness report here: https://system1group.com/the-creator-effectiveness-playbook Timestamps 00:00 - Start 01:23 - The most surprising thing about Lara 03:11 - How Adobe have stood out at Cannes 05:50 - What makes an influential CMO? 06:59 - How to manage a business through change 09:54 - Lara’s vision for Adobe 13:33 - Finding inspiration from a brand’s history 15:13 - Where AI has been used in service of creativity 18:03 - AI to enhance creativity vs increasing efficiency 20:42 - Why creativity still matters in the AI age 23:41 - What skillsets does Adobe hire for in marketing? 25:22 - The traits of the most successful CMOs 28:55 - The company plan on a page 30:49 - The power of repitition 32:05 - Progress over perfection at Adobe 33:14 - The two way door approach 37:19 - The best advice Lara has ever recieved
#274
July 13 · 41 min
OpenAI on what every CMO needs to know about AI with BCG
In this episode, Mark Abraham, Managing Director and Senior Partner at BCG, joins Elke Karskens, Head of International Marketing at OpenAI to explore how AI is already transforming marketing and what's coming next. We discuss OpenAI's remarkable growth, the launch of its first advertising campaign, and how marketers can prepare for a future where AI is embedded across every function. The conversation covers how brands can increase their visibility in ChatGPT, the opportunities created by tools like Codex, the skills tomorrow's CMOs will need, and why the real value of AI isn't just efficiency, it's effectiveness. This episode has been produced in partnership with BCG. Browse their CMO Report here: https://www.bcg.com/publications/2026/making-the-agentic-marketing-transformation-a-reality Timestamps 00:00 - Start 01:16 - Open AI’s meteoric rise 02:07 - Breakthrough moments for OpenAI 03:04 - How have Open AI scaled so quickly 04:49 - What will be led by humans and what will be led by AI in 5 years 06:09 - Open AI’s impressive first ad campaign 08:32 - Launch of the Open AI advertising platform 13:01 - How brands can rank in ChatGPT 14:44 - How brands can use Codex 17:44 - How do CMOs feel about AI 19:34 - How do you deliver transformation with AI 20:55 - What skillsets are going to be in demand for the future CMO 23:29 - Which brands are using AI well today 24:52 - What can we do with AI in a year from now we can’t do today? 29:45 - Why BCG and Open AI work together 30:53 - What don’t people understand about AI? 35:11 - Efficiency and cost savings vs effectiveness in AI 38:15 - Best advice you’ve ever been given
#276
July 8 · 1 hr 26 min
Byron Sharp vs Mark Ritson - 5 big marketing truths we agree on
For years, Mark Ritson and Byron Sharp have been two of the most influential and most opinionated voices in marketing. They've challenged each other's ideas, debated strategy, and helped shape how an entire generation of marketers thinks. Now, for the first time in more than a decade, at Cannes Lions, they sit down together to answer a simple question: what do they actually agree on? From How Brands Grow and the 95:5 rule to distinctiveness, the 4 Ps, mass marketing, luxury brands, purpose and AI, this conversation explores the fundamental marketing principles they both believe every marketer should understand. There are still plenty of disagreements (and more than a few jokes at each other's expense), but this is a rare opportunity to hear two of the industry's biggest thinkers build a shared foundation for modern marketing. This episode is brought to you by System1. Download their creator effectiveness report here: https://system1group.com/the-creator-effectiveness-playbook Timestamps 00:00:00 - Start 00:00:40 - Teaser 00:02:08 - Mark Ritson on Champagne 00:03:42 - When did Mark and Byron meet 00:05:36 - Why Byron and Mark are coming together after a decade 00:07:25 - When Jon met Byron 00:08:57 - Is AI more brand centric than humans? 00:11:08 - Mark and Byron’s criticism on their Cannes talk 00:12:49 - The problem with academia 00:13:45 - What do marketers still not understand about How Brands Grow 00:18:06 - You are not the customer 00:20:56 - Distinctiveness vs relative differentiation 00:28:45 - Why we need to control all 4 Ps 00:33:10 - The 95:5 rule 00:39:20 - Why Byron doesn’t like the term “Long Term” 00:42:41 - The role of mass marketing 00:46:40 - How to do mass marketing as a challenger brand 00:53:45 - How long does it take to build a proper brand 00:56:10 - What does Byron think of P&G 00:58:47 - The power of distinctive brand assets 01:03:42 - Why brand anniversaries are pointless 01:04:40 - How luxury brands grow 01:09:16 - The role of purpose 01:16:58 - The dark lord of penetration 01:18:17 - What pet name does Byron have for Mark 01:23:17 - Closing remarks

Showing 1–20 of 33 episodes