the tortoise & the hare

rigid & flexible | the tortoise & the hare 

In today’s episode, Brooke and Ben dive into different ways of thinking — open and closed, fixed and fluid and whatever exists in between. They discuss their different approaches to rule-following, how they deal with opinion chameleons and why finding common ground is one of the most effective ways to have a constructive conversation. Ben also explains why he loves playing the devil’s advocate (and why Brooke finds it infuriating!) and finishes with a hard-hitting question: rigid or flexible lollies — which is better? They discuss: hypersensitivity Brooke’s EMDR experience dealing with narrow-minded people chameleon opinions and why they’re so confusing rule-followers vs rebels improving cognitive flexibility how to engage different opinions without losing your mind why hope hurts sometimes the great lolly debate: rigid vs flexible Thanks for listening! Links: Find everything mentioned in today’s show at brookemcalary.substack.com Become a paying supporter of ttath and get double the episodes! Weekly shows delivered straight to your inbox for just $8AUD/month or $80AUD/yr. If video is your jam, subscribe to our YouTube channel @thetortoiseandthehare Access the full, human-made transcript here Credits: the tortoise & the hare is a McAlary Media production. Produced and hosted by Brooke McAlary and Ben McAlary Edited by Ben McAlary Studio equipment supplied by shot.studio Theme music is Edgar Allan Poe by Modern Aquatic Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

wrinkles & pimples | the tortoise & the hare

When it comes to age and youth, body image takes a beating at both ends. Can we find a gentler way through the years? In today’s show, Brooke and Ben discuss the duality of wrinkles & pimples — i.e. the visible elements of youth and aging — and how they are literally in the middle of it right now, with both wrinkles and pimples (and grey hair and stiff backs in the morning). They discuss: changing body image in their mid-40s why gender-affirming care (including hair removal, plastic surgery, make-up and hormone therapy) should be accessible to everyone the changing role of body image for boys and men over the past decade what our faces and bodies are actually for the billionaires who want to live forever and go to great lengths to avoid aging Thanks for listening! Links: Find everything mentioned in today’s show at brookemcalary.substack.com Become a paying supporter of ttath and get double the episodes! Weekly shows delivered straight to your inbox for just $5AUD/month for a limited time If video is your jam, subscribe to our YouTube channel @thetortoiseandthehare Access the full, human-made transcript here Credits: the tortoise & the hare is a McAlary Media production. Produced and hosted by Brooke McAlary and Ben McAlary Edited by Ben McAlary Studio equipment supplied by shot.studio Theme music is Edgar Allan Poe by Modern Aquatic Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

fast & slow | the tortoise & the hare

fast & slow | Is there a middle ground between the two? Or are we destined to wrestle our inner-tortoise and inner-hare forever? In the first episode of the tortoise & the hare, Brooke and Ben revisit slow living one last time (no, really!) to see where they exist on the spectrum of speed today and why they decided to keep the slow living reference in the new show’s name. Initially, slow living was a new way of seeing the world. It provided freedom and community and opportunity. But within a few years, the wellness industry exploded and slow-living voices competed to become a new version of the Joneses — the most slow, the most aesthetic, the most minimalist. What started as a fluid, adaptable idea became consumption-driven and highly aspirational. Links: Find everything mentioned in today’s show at brookemcalary.substack.com Become a paying supporter of ttath and get double the episodes! Weekly shows delivered straight to your inbox for just $5/month for a limited time If video is your jam, subscribe to our YouTube channel @thetortoiseandthehare Access the full, human-made transcript here Thanks for tuning in! Credits: the tortoise & the hare is a McAlary Media production. Produced and hosted by Brooke McAlary and Ben McAlary Edited by Ben McAlary Studio equipment supplied by shot.studio Theme music is Edgar Allan Poe by Modern Aquatic Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

coming soon | the tortoise & the hare

Listen to the tortoise & the hare preview now. The first episode drops 20th August 2026! Fast and slow. Young and old. Hard and soft. Open and closed. Real and fake. Hide and seek. Pleasure and pain… Life is full of dualities and extremes and pick-a-sides. But most of our days are spent in the messy middle. the tortoise & the hare is a weekly show from Brooke and Ben McAlary, creators of the much-loved Slow Home Podcast (RIP). Each episode is a human-made, homegrown, perfectly imperfect conversation about the either/or of life and the vast grey area in between. Because we all contain multitudes. So let’s talk about them. *** Don't forget: Subscribe to ttath in your favourite podcast app so you don't miss an episode Join us on Substack to become a supporter, access weekly shows and get new episodes direct to your inbox Find us on YouTube if you prefer to watch your pods Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

A Fond Farewell: Episode 17

Instead of the usual conversation between Brooke and Ben, today's episode is simply a reading of the final ever edition of The Tortoise newsletter. Take a listen, and please know that it has been an absolute pleasure to be heard by you over the years. https://brookemcalary.substack.com/p/sometimes-life-surprises-us Much love and thanks for listening, Brooke and Ben xx Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Balance: Episode 16

A more accurate title for this episode might have been: The Myth of Work-Life Balance, because both Ben and Brooke think it’s fundamentally BS, but that was too long a title, so Balance it is. In this episode, they look at the idea of balance through a post-lockdown, new-workplace lens, in an effort to make sense of why it feels harder to achieve now, and what we might be able to do to create it. They dig into their own definitions of balance, the pros and cons when it comes to self-employment, how they each differentiate between work time and non-work time and why they find the goal of work/life balance to be damaging. The also talk about anti-balance or tilting as an alternative, as well as the impact of the upcoming “right to disconnect” legislation, the attraction of "working ahead", how to approach changes in your own workplace when you’re not self-employed, and why it’s important to start small, specific and slow. It’s a juicy topic, not least because it applies to everyone differently and we hope you enjoy it. Head over to The Tortoise for the full show notes, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Thanks for listening! Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Body Image: Episode 15

In this month's episode, Brooke and Ben dig into the topic of body image. How do we see ourselves in the world? How does that inform our choices and beliefs? What inputs have the most impact on our self-image? What began as a conversation about "hot rodent men" became an exploration of how we take up space in the world, the comments, trends, beliefs and expectations we internalise, how those things impact our behaviours and the role that media and marketing play in all of it. Brooke shares how her body image has shifted over the past few years, due to health issues, getting older, shifting priorities and the impact of slow living, and Ben looks at the differences in body image for young boys versus men. They also discuss their different experiences of negative body image growing up, how body and beauty trends keep us feeling "wrong," why the resurgence of “skinny” might be in direct response to body positivity, why body neutrality could be a healthier place to aim when it comes to self-image, and the importance of body appreciation and its role in our well-being. Head over to The Tortoise for the full show notes, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Thanks for listening! Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Pleasure: Episode 14

Pleasure. Just the word brings a little shiver to the spine, doesn't it? Defined as “a feeling or experience that involves enjoyment or satisfaction,” in today’s episode, Brooke and Ben dig a little deeper into what pleasure is in real terms, what it means to them personally and why expanding our individual definitions might be the key to unlocking a whole new way of experiencing life. For Brooke it relates to not only her word of the year (joy) but also the theme she's currently exploring over on The Tortoise — rebellious living. While at first glance, pleasure doesn’t appear to be particularly related to living rebelliously, throughout this conversation, she and Ben dig into why centring pleasure in a world that feels too much, too heavy, too overwhelming really can be an act of rebellion. (Honestly!) In a wide-ranging conversation, they also discuss how the senses are related to pleasure, why redefining and reclaiming it could increase the amount of pleasure we experience, the relationship between pleasure and addiction and why embracing joy and delight might make us less prone to capitalistic manipulation. They also talk about the six-second kiss that's been a game-changer, list some of their own simple pleasures and talk about the importance of becoming a better self-observer if we're going to invite more pleasure into our lives. Head over to The Tortoise for the full show notes, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Thanks for listening! Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Soft Life: Episode 13

If you spend any time on TikTok, you've probably seen the #softlife trend pop up over the past couple of years. Brooke and Ben aren't on TikTok, so are late to the party as usual, but wanted to dive into the sister movement of slow living anyway. In today's episode, they look at what soft living is, where it began, how it relates to slow living, and why it's following a similar trajectory as that of self-care, slow living, and other counter-cultural movements. (ie. becoming increasingly mainstream and commercial). They look at soft living as the opposite of hard living (which proves both obvious and helpful) and try to define it for themselves. For Brooke it revolves around joy, and for Ben its in learning how to ask for help - both of which offer unexpected ways of looking at softness. They also talk about the consumerism attached to these movements, and offer some practical suggestions on how to create space for softness in your day-to-day life. Head over to The Tortoise for the full show notes, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Thanks for listening! Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Curveballs: Episode 12

You know the feeling. Life is motoring on in much the way you expected it to, you’ve got plans, you’ve got goals and then — BAM — a curveball gets whacked your way. Suddenly the plans, the goals, the vague idea of what we thought life would look like are shaken. In this month's episode of The Tortoise, Brooke and Ben are talking curveballs, trying to answer the question of how to navigate the unexpected challenges life can throw in our way. In this conversation they look at what defines a curveball, how to use some of the ideas of slow living to help navigate them, as we as: examples of some curveballs they've faced themselves recently the role that simply noticing — our emotions, our stories, our egos — can play in accepting and moving forward once we face an unexpected challenge “feeling our feelings” as the first step in moving on from a curveball, and why there are many different ways to do that how acceptance of what is can help us to move forward and why it’s such a difficult thing to achieve the rising movement of Stoicism and concerns about the difference between being stoic and repressed two different ways of using perspective to reframe our curveballs over time the role of gratitude in moving on from an abrupt life change, and why we can’t always rush straight to it why self-care is so important when navigating new life circumstances Head over to The Tortoise for the full show notes, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Thanks for listening! Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Joyful Living: Episode 11

Today’s episode is all about joyful living. What it is, what it isn’t, how to get more of it and how it differs from happiness. Stemming from Brooke's intention to try and find more joy in 2024, this conversation is delightfully and unexpectedly wide-ranging, and in it Ben and Brooke explore: the definition of joy, and why it means so many different things to so many different people why much of the literature around joy is religious or spiritual how joy differs from happiness and how it is similar the role that alcohol has on our ability to experience happiness and joy (and how Brooke's experience has changed since she stopped drinking) how to adopt a lens of joy and happiness to life when you’re not a joyful person by default why choosing joy is a revolutionary act what the difference is between choosing joy and toxic positivity how we can add more joy to our lives Head over to The Tortoise for the full show notes, including links to the articles mentioned in today's episode, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Thanks for listening! Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

2023 Top Ten: Episode 10

Welcome to Episode 10 of The Tortoise - the p(l)odcast all about the possibilities of slow. In today's show — the final one for 2023 — Brooke and Ben look back over the year that was and walk through their personal Top Ten list. That is, their favourite: TV show Small detail Movie New destination Book (you know I failed to limit this one) Discovery Album New listening (podcast or otherwise) Meal Experience It’s a fun thing to do together, and they'd love to hear your Top Ten list for 2023. Head over to The Tortoise to share your list and to see the full show notes, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Thanks for listening, and see you in 2024! Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Addiction: Episode 9

This month's episode digs into the topic of addiction (and more broadly, obsessive behaviour) for things like tech-use, busyness, food and consumption. If you need help with addiction or mental health, there's a list of resources over at The Tortoise. In today's show, Ben shares his experience with tech over-use and the links he sees between it and the hustle-grind-capitalism-productivity culture, and he and Brooke look at how the proliferation of tech (especially smart phones and social media) have increased our desire for instant gratification. Brooke talks through her compulsion to consume bad news, and shares a few ways she's trying to break those patterns of behaviour. She also talks about the role that tech and consumerism intertwine to create a world that feels simultaneously too much and not enough, and how that has her and many other women she knows feeling angry. It's an interesting and meandering conversation that will hopefully leave you with lots to think about. Head over to The Tortoise for the full show notes, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Thanks for listening! Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hard Times: Episode 8

Today Brooke and Ben are talking about hard times. Or more specifically, how to deal with the emotional heaviness that comes from living through really difficult things. Digging into this feeling of heaviness, they discuss how they're trying to acknowledge and accept the challenges, as well as the tools they use to help them move forward. They also talk about practical ways to protect ourselves when things feel hard, why limiting social media is a powerful way of drawing boundaries, the impact of gentle activism, why rage-cleaning can help process anger, the rebelliousness of finding joy and why pairing all of these things with action is so important. Hopefully this conversation shows that it’s okay to look for and hold onto joy in amongst the difficult times. Head over to The Tortoise for the full show notes, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Thanks for listening! Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Seasonal Living: Episode 7

In this month's episode, Brooke and Ben dig into the topic of seasonal living. Not only the calendar kind of seasonal living, but also the other seasons that exist in life too. The ones that don’t change every three months. The internal seasons, the life seasons, the in-built cycles and rhythms that — whether we realise it or not — have a profound impact on how we live, how we grow, how we show up in the world. They begin with a pretty traditional look at what seasonal living means — that is, how it can impact the food we eat, the activities we do, our energy, our personal environmental impact, our connection to the world around us and the rhythms that drive it all. But from there, they dig into the broader conversation around seasonal living, including the seasons we experience throughout life, why many people find themselves resistant to the stereotypical ‘spring, summer, autumn, winter’ analogy, the archetypes that mark our way through adulthood and the importance of recognising the inherent messiness of transitions. It's thought-provoking and juicy in all the best ways. Head over to The Tortoise for the full show notes, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Thanks for listening! Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Self-care: Episode 6

For a term we throw around a lot, self-care is not all that well defined. It’s attached loosely to the ideas of wellness, self-help, relaxation and mindfulness, and so often comes to us packaged, commoditised and ready to be bought/sold. Ben and Brooke start today’s episode by trying to define self-care, and eventually land on one that is as broad and inclusive as possible: Self-care can be anything that leaves us feeling cared for or supported from within. From there, they dig deeper into their own experiences of self-care, including how they make time for it, what constitutes "boring self-care", the weird rituals that act as self-care on the days there's not a lot of time and the parts of self-care they struggle with. Brooke then reflects on a comment left on a recent Tortoise newsletter about toxic positivity, which asked about the difference between resilience, positive thinking, wallowing and toxic positivity. It's a juicy topic that both Brooke and Ben have some thoughts on, and will no doubt return to again. Head over to The Tortoise for the full show notes, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Thanks for listening! Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Tech and Kids: Episode 5

For our kids (and adults as well), there is barely a part of life that isn't somehow connected to smartphones, social media or screens, and they're starting to feel the effects of being constantly connected. In today's episode, Ben and Brooke talk about their experience raising two high school-ages kids (12 and 14) and the constant negotiations around tech boundaries. They also talk about the broader impact that high levels of screen time are having on kids in general, the challenges that are beginning to emerge in regards to relationships, well-being and self-esteem, and what we as adults can do to help support them. Brooke also reflects on a hugely impactful documentary she saw recently, that has given her something that's been in short supply lately: hope. Head over to The Tortoise for the full show notes, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Mental Load: Episode 4

It's a phrase we hear a lot about — the mental load — but what does it actually mean? And how can we navigate life while carrying it? Brooke and Ben discuss their differing definitions of mental load and how it plays out for them personally. They also dig into the broader conversation (Is a heavier mental load a gender issue or one of personality? Is it about convenience? Does it differ across generations?) and look at suggestions on how to make changes that could help lessen or even out the load in a relationship. In the reflection part of the pod they discuss the big, beautiful benefits of being content versus being happy, and dig into how our values might help define both contentment/happiness. Head over to The Tortoise for the full show notes, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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The Sandwich Generation: Episode 3

If you're feeling squashed between competing needs - raising kids and caring for parents while trying to work/live/look after yourself, for example - then this episode is for you. Brooke and Ben talk about what it means to be a part of the 'sandwich generation', and why, for them, it represents a transition rather than a challenge to be overcome. They discuss what being sandwiched could look like, why the additional pressures of caring so often fall to women, how they manage expectations, why they're thinking so far into the future, the slow living tools that might help, and yes, their favourite sandwiches (yes, really). In the reflection part of the pod, they talk about different types of community, and the lightbulb moment that came in a recent comments section over on The Tortoise. Head over to The Tortoise for the full show notes, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Social Media and Wellness: Episode 2

What exactly is "wellness" anyway? We hear it tossed about as an umbrella term covering health and fitness and diet and mental well-being and any number of topics, but what does it mean to try and achieve wellness? And what does any of it have to do with slow living? In today's episode, Brooke and Ben dig into wellness and social media - the good, the bad, the quackery, the evidence-based and the liver-eating diets - exploring the messy mixture of influencers, algorithms and genuine well-being tools that exist in the trillion-dollar industry. It's an interesting and fraught conversation, because not only do definitions of wellness differ greatly, as do our individual levels of access, exposure and finances, but there is a clear crossover between wellness and diet culture that muddies the waters even more. And, while some of it is undoubtedly harmful, there are many parts of the wellness industry that offer genuine help too. Brooke and Ben look at their own experiences with wellness influencers, as well as their own hang-ups, privileges and blind spots. In the reflection segment, they discuss the benefits of embracing physical discomfort, which leads to a conversation about the different kinds of discomforts we might experience and the pros and cons they offer. They both give a quick update on their year-long experiments (the 1% and the four-day work week), one of which is going well, the other...not so much. Head over to The Tortoise for the full show notes, and if you haven't already, make sure to subscribe to the free weekly newsletter while you're there. Join The Tortoise Community: https://brookemcalary.substack.com/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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